迪士尼公主
迪士尼公主 Most Feminist DP Countdown! 日 4: Pick the LEAST feminist. (Elimination based on comments!!)
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34 fans picked: |
茉莉, 茉莉花
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Rapunzel
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Ariel
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花木兰
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Belle
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Pocahontas
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Tiana
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Make your pick! | next poll >> |
9. Cinderella
8. Snow White
7. ?
Please try to remove your bias and please try to remember that none of the princesses are really that feminist!
Personally I may change my answer. I agree with what has been said in other rounds, that Jasmine is all talk and no action. But I admire that she does voice her opinions and at least tries. However when it does come down to it, Jasmine does deflect to being a "damsel" a lot, constantly having to be saved by Aladdin. And in a fight (in the first movie only, in the sequels she's pretty bad ass) her first reaction is too use the weapon of seduction.
Try to keep it civil guys.
I could've went with Ariel on this poll but then I remembered that she DID rescue Eric which would definitely be considered a huge positive when looking at things from a feminist-perspective. Rapunzel doesn't really do very much at all, when compared with the remaining Princesses, to keep the feminists happy. I don't think Jasmine is the most feminist Princess but I don't think it's a very fair result for Jasmine to be eliminated straight after Snow White and before Rapunzel/Ariel. She's clearly a much stronger character, which feminists like, than Rapunzel and yes it's understandable because Rapunzel has been locked in a tower for the duration of her life, but that's neither here nor there.
One of the main reasons I'd say that Ariel is more feminist-friendly than Rapunzel is that she is directly fighting back against a MALE oppressor, trying to prove her maturity and worth as a growing girl to a woman, which does have something to do with her gender-- Triton /was/ overprotective partially because Ariel is a girl, after all-- and in the end, she PROVES it to him. He respects her wishes, changes his mind, and yes, helps her accomplish her goal-- but Ariel did 99% of the work. And Ariel never asked Sebastian and Flounder for help-- in fact, she spurns them-- but they voluntarily join. For example, when Ariel turns human, she's gonna do it alone---but Flounder and Sebastian help her. Albeit, she needs their help, but there's a difference between asking and what they do. Also, Ariel jumping in after the ship, again, it's small, but she tries to fight for herself with no regard on relying on anyone else, of course she'll need the help, but the mental independence is still there, which is more than I can say for Rapunzel.
On the other hand, Rapunzel forced Flynn into reliance and basically made it so he had no choice-- yes, this is good to have power over him, but she never even considers going it on her own. She basically says 'this guy's gonna be my aid or I'm not leaving the tower'. And Rapunzel is fighting back against a female oppressor, not male, and although the gender balance issues may be interesting between Flynn and Rapunzel, I feel they're more poignant between Triton & Ariel, because there's no romance to throw it off balance. Can't even pass the Bechdel test.
You can say that Rapunzel's dream was at least not about winning a guy, the difference here is that Ariel is choosing this to be her dream, not some guy coming to sweep her off her feet. If this is what Ariel chose for herself, it's no less feminist than Rapunzel's.
Again, none of this is REALLY ideal, and I'll be pushing for Belle, Mulan, and Pocahontas to be in the top 3.
Ariel on the other hand has the dream to go to land for a long time, but she doesn't go before a man!!!! crosses her path. He old dream, to go to land becomes secondary to her love to Eric. And she doesn't take the final step to go because SHE makes the decision, but because Ursula manipulates her to do it. While Rapunzel makes the decision to go DESPITE the manipulations from Gothel and later Flynn himself.
Plus, while Rapunzel has been emotionally abused her whole live, Ariel ISN'T opressed. She has a normal daughter/father relationship with her father, Triton doesn't try to CONTROL her, he tries to PROTECT her. And Ariel constantly scornes this protection only to end up in danger, and then her (all male) friends have to go and help her out of the mess she herself created.
Jasmine is even worse, though. All talk, no action.
I can't believe people are choosing Jasmine... oi
@BelleAnastasia agree
In Ariel's eyes, Triton IS an oppressor, and technically as a character he is the catalyst that causes her to rebel against him. Regardless, Ariel's main "opponent" (I use this term loosely) in the film is Triton, not Ursula. While Rapunzel's is Gothel.
Swanpride, again...you've been really biased here. Rapunzel needs Flynn, Maximus, Pascal and the thugs for encouragement. In fact, much like in Ariel's case, they are moving the plot forward, and she's just following along.
LightningRed, I'm sorry but I don't get what being angry has to do with any of this.
Yeah, Rapunzel needs just as much male help, if not more, than Ariel, and in fact Rapunzel demands it.
And Swanpride, since when does more bravery equal more feminist? What does the fact that Jas/Poca/Ariel 'expect to survive' and Rapunzel realizes the danger, have to do with feminism?
I will be interested to see who the top three are. I am sure Mulan and Pocahontas will be in there, but I will be interested to see whether Belle or Tiana makes it.
And that's the difference between Ariel and Rapunzel. Ariel, who isn't opressed at all (there is nothing in the movie which suggests that the rules for mermaids and mermen are somhow different, the rule she is rebelling against is one, everyone has to follow, regardless of gender), goes to land with no concept at all. Without Eric immediatly finding and taking care of her, her fate would have been quite different. She would have been pennyless (and clotheless) on the streets. Her friends not only give her emotional support, they have come to her aid all the time, and always because of situations, she orchestrated. In short, Ariel is a character who says: Woman are capable of some things, but they are too stupid to think ahead, and in the end, they always need a man to come to their rescue.
Ariel is a good efford, but Rapunzel is in my eyes the next step. Someone who knows his own abilities (and what who knows what she doesn't know), someone who might not know much about some areas, but is nevertheless competent in other areas. None of the dangerous situations Rapunzel finds herself in are in any shape or form her fault, and she proves herself capapble to deal with them. Yes, she has emotional support too, but unlike Ariel, who is quite selfish, Rapunzel isn't selfish at all.
Jasmine, btw, is a character who really has a feminist problem to deal with, but since she (unlike all the other princesses) isn't the protagonist of her movie, she always gets shoved aside, so that Aladdin can rescue the day.
I find it interesting that a lot of things people are using as arguments that princesses are being anti-feminist are not arguments for why they are being anti-gender equality, but why they are not being anti-male, which is not feminism but sexism. I really don't see what the big deal is about Rapunzel using Flynn, he was the only outsider who had come in eighteen years, he was likely to be the only chance she would have to leave and see the lights. Rapunzel was being an opportunist. She would have relied on a woman who she met just as much as she relied on Flynn. I don't see what is anti-feminist about her relying on a man when she would have relied on a woman just as much. I also don't really get the "Ariel didn't try to become a human before meeting Eric" argument, seeing as she never had a chance to become a human before then. How do we know she wouldn't have jumped at the chance before then? She might not have gone to Ursula, but she was in a pretty low moment then, and people have a tendency to do crazy irrational things at times like that.
magicfairydust- Why is Ariel being girly anti-feminist? Feminism isn't about women abandoning their femininity but being able to be accepted for it, isn't it?
Swanpride- I get what you say about Jasmine not being the protagonist, I've even made that point before, but in the movies where the princess is the protagonist, the prince is very rarely shoved aside so the princess can save the day, or at least he plays an active role in helping her. The only real exception I can see is John Smith, but is certainly more proactive than Jasmine.
I agree-- there is nothing wrong with Ariel being feminine. In fact, it goes AGAINST feminism to say that Ariel has to be more stereotypically manly to prove her worth.
And I agree about Ariel-- I still think she would have taken the deal from Ursula just to become human, before she had met Eric. The terms of the deal would probably be different. She would have to be in another moment of great distress, but yeah, she'd still do it. It's just in this moment, Ursula saw it to her advantage to seize this opportunity and offer this deal to Ariel. I don't think Ariel had even been AWARE that it was a possibility.
Your points about Rapunzel are absolutely fantastic.
Nothing more can be said or argued, you freaking nailed it.
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